"Everyone walking up to Communion together symbolizes our 'pilgrim journey.'" As if we don't all walk up the same aisle when going to an altar rail lol
I truly don't want to be uncharitable but this feels like doubling down on something just for the sake of it because he'd rather do that than admit he was wrong
As someone who is a member in the Diocese of Charlotte, I can tell you nobody likes the extraordinary ministers delivering communion. The line for the priest is always the longest. Since there is only one TLM chapel, from me at least that is an hour drive when before it would've been around 40 minutes. Lots of parishioners at our church kneel. I have seen more women veiling at mass.
This seems like a weird line in the sand for a bishop to draw, and it not only excludes trad Catholics but also Catholics from non-US traditions. It feels like a “English only policy” and “our house, our rules” when there’s a range of accepted practices in the broader church…and that’s fine. I object to the idea that there’s a “more pious” way of receiving the Eucharist, though. That seems to be unnecessarily divisive, too.
Sorry, but it is more pious in every way. Kneeling is the ultimate sign of submission. Having Jesus carefully placed on your tongue is Receiving. Holding out your hand and then having to Take it in your own dirty hands is not. Jesus not up for grabs. To say nothing of the problem of people being able to easily take the Body of Christ from their hands and deliver it to desecration such as a Black Mass. The practice is just lazy sloppiness. Somewhat like wearing casual crap clothing to Mass as well. There are plenty of parishes trying to encourage modesty in dress: No shorts, no sleeveless, no skin tight, no see-through. Is that really so hard for your Lord?
The GIRM itself leaves plenty of room for shenanigans. The old rubrics were clear and unequivocal. Bishop Martin is the throwback, insisting there is only one way to do things. Certainly not in the spirit of the Council!
Anecdotally, whether due to parishioner age or lack of formation, we never had them in Florida. There is nothing like receiving the way we were intended while on vacation! Sometimes (even now) you get odd looks for receiving on the tongue. This too shall pass :)
I attend mass in the diocese of Charlotte and would appreciate knowing in which parishes "the Father so-and-so show" is playing, because I haven't found it. I have seen some "holier than thou" congregants performing their own pious practices (sometimes very obviously ostentatiously) such as veiling, kneeling to receive Holy Communion, holding hands during recitation of the Lord's Prayer, etc. It seems like this is what Bishop Martin is trying to address. And it seems like he is onto something, because the fierceness with which poeple are clinging to their personal preferences makes me wonder if they are making idols out of them.
You think Bishop Martin also wants to stop women who choose to veil in Mass from doing so? On what conceivable basis? And has he expressed any opposition to holding hands during the Our Father? That would be heartening, actually, since that's the one of your list that's actually a novelty.
Holding hands at Our Father is NOT a pious practice, neither is the Sign of Peace. Both are discouraged. Whereas, women veiled their heads in the Bible (see St Paul) and kneeling at an altar rail was the ONLY way to receive, for most centuries. That is not ostentatious piety; yet raising your hands at the elevation (“We lift them up to the Lord”) is not part of the liturgy or proper at all. Neither is applause at the end of Mass. Cardinal Ratzinger wrote against that in his book Spirit Of the Liturgy. Applause makes of it a performance.
I attended a Baptism of an 8 mth old in Leitrim last week. The priest had the need to deviate from the formal practice to show the young adults he was his own man. After blessing the child he insisted that the 60 people attending come forward and make the sign of the cross on the child. The child screamed and clawed at every hand that came near her for the 10 mins it took. The child was traumatised but the priest saw nothing wrong. Only 2 or 3 of us refused to comply with the priests vanity solo run.
"Everyone walking up to Communion together symbolizes our 'pilgrim journey.'" As if we don't all walk up the same aisle when going to an altar rail lol
I truly don't want to be uncharitable but this feels like doubling down on something just for the sake of it because he'd rather do that than admit he was wrong
Yep. Can't walk it back because that takes humility and having to see the issue through the eyes of others.
As someone who is a member in the Diocese of Charlotte, I can tell you nobody likes the extraordinary ministers delivering communion. The line for the priest is always the longest. Since there is only one TLM chapel, from me at least that is an hour drive when before it would've been around 40 minutes. Lots of parishioners at our church kneel. I have seen more women veiling at mass.
This seems like a weird line in the sand for a bishop to draw, and it not only excludes trad Catholics but also Catholics from non-US traditions. It feels like a “English only policy” and “our house, our rules” when there’s a range of accepted practices in the broader church…and that’s fine. I object to the idea that there’s a “more pious” way of receiving the Eucharist, though. That seems to be unnecessarily divisive, too.
Sorry, but it is more pious in every way. Kneeling is the ultimate sign of submission. Having Jesus carefully placed on your tongue is Receiving. Holding out your hand and then having to Take it in your own dirty hands is not. Jesus not up for grabs. To say nothing of the problem of people being able to easily take the Body of Christ from their hands and deliver it to desecration such as a Black Mass. The practice is just lazy sloppiness. Somewhat like wearing casual crap clothing to Mass as well. There are plenty of parishes trying to encourage modesty in dress: No shorts, no sleeveless, no skin tight, no see-through. Is that really so hard for your Lord?
The GIRM itself leaves plenty of room for shenanigans. The old rubrics were clear and unequivocal. Bishop Martin is the throwback, insisting there is only one way to do things. Certainly not in the spirit of the Council!
Anecdotally, whether due to parishioner age or lack of formation, we never had them in Florida. There is nothing like receiving the way we were intended while on vacation! Sometimes (even now) you get odd looks for receiving on the tongue. This too shall pass :)
I attend mass in the diocese of Charlotte and would appreciate knowing in which parishes "the Father so-and-so show" is playing, because I haven't found it. I have seen some "holier than thou" congregants performing their own pious practices (sometimes very obviously ostentatiously) such as veiling, kneeling to receive Holy Communion, holding hands during recitation of the Lord's Prayer, etc. It seems like this is what Bishop Martin is trying to address. And it seems like he is onto something, because the fierceness with which poeple are clinging to their personal preferences makes me wonder if they are making idols out of them.
You think Bishop Martin also wants to stop women who choose to veil in Mass from doing so? On what conceivable basis? And has he expressed any opposition to holding hands during the Our Father? That would be heartening, actually, since that's the one of your list that's actually a novelty.
Holding hands at Our Father is NOT a pious practice, neither is the Sign of Peace. Both are discouraged. Whereas, women veiled their heads in the Bible (see St Paul) and kneeling at an altar rail was the ONLY way to receive, for most centuries. That is not ostentatious piety; yet raising your hands at the elevation (“We lift them up to the Lord”) is not part of the liturgy or proper at all. Neither is applause at the end of Mass. Cardinal Ratzinger wrote against that in his book Spirit Of the Liturgy. Applause makes of it a performance.
I attended a Baptism of an 8 mth old in Leitrim last week. The priest had the need to deviate from the formal practice to show the young adults he was his own man. After blessing the child he insisted that the 60 people attending come forward and make the sign of the cross on the child. The child screamed and clawed at every hand that came near her for the 10 mins it took. The child was traumatised but the priest saw nothing wrong. Only 2 or 3 of us refused to comply with the priests vanity solo run.